Image credit: Dnipro Hotel from Pixabay
Bathhouses are such a staple of gay culture that it may come as a surprise to some that 1984 regulations put in place in San Francisco effectively closed down these establishments in the city.
However, that may soon change as gay Castro District Supervisor Rafael Mandelman is pushing for the lifting of those measures and hopefully encourage the re-emergence of those establishments in San Francisco.
In a statement, Mandelman pointed out that these regulations were put in place during the height of the AIDS crisis and no longer reflect the current situation with HIV.
“Decades later, with the emergence of PrEP and in light of San Francisco’s reduction in HIV diagnoses to under 200 for the first time since the 1980s, these regulations — including a ban on private rooms and required monitoring of patrons’ sexual activities — have no public health rationale and need to be changed,” he said.
Back in 1984, bathhouses were sued by the city and county of San Francisco for being a “public health nuisance.” While a judge ruled that they could remain open, they were required to employ “monitors” and tear down most of the walls for video rooms, cubicles, and individual booths. Fourteen bathhouses were then closed later in the year, with the remaining ones soon to follow.
However, the HIV landscape in San Francisco is now completely different. As pointed out by Mandelman and reported by The Bay Area Reporter, new HIV diagnoses in 2018 dipped below 200, with San Francisco on track to reducing new HIV cases in the area by 90 percent.
Mark Haney, a District 6 Supervisor and representative for the South of Market area, is co-sponsoring Mandelman’s legislation and said that the current rules are “discriminatory.”
“I think it was a discriminatory rule that doesn’t have any backing in public health and so it is overdue that they change it. I am glad they are coming around to it,” he said to The Bay Area Reporter.
Should the measure pass, the city health department’s minimum standards for the operation of adult sex venues will be revised so that locked doors and sex monitoring by staff will no longer be required.
Adam4Adam blog readers, we’d like to hear about your thoughts and also your favorite bathhouse experiences. Tell us about it in the comments section below!
Calling such places a “staple of gay culture” is utterly insulting. They are the lowest of the low, the parasitest of the parasites, and the primary cause of spreading of stds. They should be banned nationwide.
I’ve never been in those, but that doesn’t insult me, because I know it is true that many gays go or used to go in these establishments.
My ex boss is from San Francisco and according to him the STD rate was rather low. He went to all of them regularly until they were force to close. I’ve been to one in my life in Phoenix and it was extremely clean and the “patrons” were all clean business men who attended after work. Condoms were placed freely around the facility and were used by all. As a bisexual I’m insulted by the terminology used as those who frequent such establishments as “the lowest of the low, the parasitest of the parasites, and the primary cause of spreading… Read more »
I agree Jim. I never been in one of those (even though I’d like to try one day) but I feel you… It’s not “low” to want to have sex.
Thanks Dave, I too had a “sour” taste for bath houses simply because of the horror stories (the big bad muscle bears rape everyone in there) and bad gay porn about them, but was traveling to Phoenix with a gay friend and he persuaded me to give it a try. But Chute and Flex in Phoenix Arizona are very clean in every aspect and as I said FREE condoms everywhere. When you are traveling check the intraweb to see if any bath houses are in the city you’re visiting.
it’s ridiculous when i hear some stories online about this bathhouse or that bathhouse being unsanitary, drugs around the place, etc. .. i’ve been there, i’ve never seen things like that, i’ve also seen the clerks there cleaning up the place every hour on the hour .. for some to say it is filthy is just stupid, honey!
again, it is really up to the PERSON, the individual, it is them who makes the decisions .. if you don’t want to get an STD nor get infected by anything, you will practice SAFE and know what it is you are doing! please for Christ’s sake don’t blame others for your actions, don’t blame a bathhouse for spreading HIV or STD, what does that have to do with anything? it is YOU, and only YOU who can protect yourself, honey! YOU are responsible!
The early AIDS carriers were known for frequenting bathhouses in both NYC and SF. Made sure and kept the lights down to hide the Karposi’s. And in an age of antibiotic resistant STDs…. I’ll pass
biff , you and Father Hennepin should hook up and hate together
Father, please….live and let live – don’t like bathhouses, then don’t go….simple as that….we are each responsible for determining our own level of safety that we are willing to engage in….not all gay men enjoying random & stranger sex, but some do….kinda like the abortion issue – don’t believe in abortion, then don’t have one….again…simple as that…..
I completely disagree with Father Hennepin. Gay and Bi guys need a place to go and get off, have some sexual fun, and meet others. It’s much better that guys have a place to go to be safe and have sexual fun instead of cruising the parks, restrooms, and streets, etc exposing them selves to the public and minors, and risking the chance of being arrested, etc. Also getting together in a bathhouse or adult arcade is much safer that risking being robbed, shot, or hurt out in a public place. As far as the risk of getting STDs, it’s… Read more »
yes, i totally agree, i don’t always feel safe cruising around adult bookstores, restrooms and parks .. bathhouses are so much safer to cruise the hot sexy men
I agree with this. We already have enough damning stereotypes against us. Calling filthy and STD infested bath houses a “staple” of the LGBT community is a disgrace. It may have been in the past when people couldn’t be as freely open or have the resources so they had to result to such places to meet up, but things are quite different today. It’s bad enough we have resources like Grindr openly a breeding ground for diseases and STD’s because everyone thinks they can get Prep and they are invisible to everything, only to later develop anal warts and wonder… Read more »
Well said, even if I’m a low parasite.
Hahahaha. Can tell you go to the bathhouse.
What is the primary cause of sti’s now since the closure of “those bathhouses”?
Your assessment for the primary cause of the spread of sexually transmitted infections (STI’s), is a stretch. Adult venues, including bathhouses, are not the primary cause. By your comment, you’re leaving out under developed countries/areas, which are lucky if they have running water. Also, heterosexual STI’s are reported/recorded more frequently than homosexual. (Sure, being gay can also be a death sentence in these under-developed countries.) However, some factors of increased spread of STI’s; lack of open and honors communication between people engaging in sexual activities, not being tested or treated when educated if a possible exposure, or when symptoms arise.… Read more »
Now that is the kind of comment I love 🙂
Well said Baby Bear
The moral posturing from guys who are hanging out on hookup sites such as A4A and using phone apps such as Grindr is surprising. In the 70’s and 80’s, the baths were the equivalent of what we’re doing with technology today. With our apps, we can hide behind the veil of “I’m just here to find a relationship” or “I’m here to make friends”. In the bathhouse, we can pretend that we’re there to use the jacuzzi or the exercise equipment. But bottom line, we’re horny, and whether it be phone app, web site, or baths, we’re there to fuck.
Religious misunderstanding and arrogance, God created GAY and Sex for us to enjoy
these establishments are not and never should be “the lowest of the low” as you call them, sir .. i, for one, have visited bathhouses, i don’t find anything about them being “parasitic”, and i’ve seen how responsible the men are in these places, condoms are always handed out to patrons, there are even health professionals that stop by handing out information on how to protect yourself and be safe .. i’ve never had an issue with catching any STD’s at a bathhouse .. it really depends on the person, bathhouses are not responsible for the spread of HIV nor… Read more »
They should just leave it the way it is. I doubt they would be visited as much as they were in pre internet days. Men can hookup in secs on an app where they would have to cruise a whole evening to find a hookup. It makes it easier for the big hos to spread stds. These establishments Are mostly for married and bi men who don’t have a place
Actually I think you’ll be surprised how many do attend.
Good grief, Jay! More things happen in bath houses. For instance, two couples (a total of four men) got married at the same time, in the same bath house but the two couples were NOT on the same wavelength. There was a substantial dowry given in each case.
A question somewhat related to your article: I wonder if any of the old places are still standing? Closed but completely vacant.
Great. Trick off the plane from latest viral contagion hits bathhouse. What could go wrong?
After already infecting the entire flight and hundreds if not thousands in the various airports. Your comment is beyond asinine.
i dont think theres anything wrong with going in a bath house.not everyone wants a partner.no differnet than going to a bar or hook up on a website.ive been in bath houses.I think it’s hot watching guys running around with just a towel.what about people who cruise parks,restareas,bookstores.you wanna close them too!
Unless I missed something in the article, I didn’t see that you or anyone else Father Hennepin would be forced or required to go to a bathhouse. They do provide a place for people to go, so they don’t have to have sex in public spaces. I never understand why people who don’t want something then they turn around and try to prevent others from doing it, whether it is abortion, gay marriage, flag protesting.
Conflicted about this one on a few fronts. Any pictures I’ve seen of gay bath houses over the decades for sure have not been as “Mary Poppins Practically Perfect in Every Wa”y (clean, sterile, healthy) as the the photo shown here. Also, in the decades since this law has passed, gays do not have to remain as underground; there’s more acceptance. Further, social media has made it much easier for gay guys to find partners (from hookups to friends with benefits to marriage material). Lastly, I’m just not sure if in 2020 bathhouses could remain economically viable; zoning laws, inspections,… Read more »
No matter if they are there or not They will still find another way to find a sex partner If not here some bathroom somewhere or another pick-up spot
They are a public health hazard.I caught HIV and many other STD’S at a bathouse.First time that I didnt go to one in a year,no std’s
It probably wasn’t the bathhouse that gave you HIV, it probably was what you did while in the bathhouse. This is the same as shooting the messenger because of the message . If you get HIV while in the Church basement while the service is going on, it the church or church building to blame? and David like the way you think. Your message hadn’t been reviewed and posted when I wrote my post.
I guess the term “safe sex” doesn’t enter into your blame equation.
Interesting. I was there a few years ago and I had a blast at the bathhouse.l
Bathhouses have always had a reputation for sleazy dens of depravity, whether deserved or not. Has people’s perception about anonymous sex in a semi-public place evolved enough to warrant such a change? Maybe in the test tube known as San Francisco it has?
It’s ridiculous that a gay public servant is advocating for public sex bath houses. Super cliche and the reason why some find it hard to be elected in the first place.
i used to go to sutro baths in the soma it was a very well run place not only gays but couples and single females then came this crack down and away it went last time i was in sfo it was a empty building when it was open it was a tax rev for the city.
I work at health care facility that provides PrEP and HIV/STD screening at our local bathhouse. There are substantially more cases of HIV/STDs diagnosed outside the bathhouse. There may be a perceived increased risk of contracting HIV/STDs at bathhouses and that’s clearly possible, however we are finding that to be rare in our population. And when it comes to “the lowest.. parasites.. “, they usually can’t afford the cost of going to a bathhouse. Sexual encounters and contraction of HIV/STD can happen anywhere and with anyone.
Bath houses are essentially orgy halls and advocating public sex–even inside a bath house–is not how we we should be presenting ourselves. Sure, all sexual orientations have those who raise a middle finger to common decency, but anonymous, gang-bang sex in bath houses is NOT a rallying point that will advance the cause of the tolerance of gay men.
Matt, why after all these years and I’ve been out since ’78, why do we need, want or desire to advance the cause of tolerance – we should demand tolerance – not change or edit ourselves so as to not “feed or tease” the straight people – why do we need their acceptance or approval? You remind me of those national fags that run the National Gay Rights Movement trying to sanitize our delivery of who we are (no public displays of Drag Queens, Leather Boys/Daddys, Dykes on Bikes – you get the picture) These fringe groups (of which I’m… Read more »
“Staple of gay culture”?? I mean yes, a lot of gay and bi men go there to get off, and nothing wrong with that if they play it safe, not harming, etc., but I don’t think it should be called a staple like it’s a badge of honor. bathhouses were in darker times when we didn’t have no rights, can get arrested for practicing ‘sodomy’, so now it’s seen like it’s optional, especially since people can meet in apps, hook up,have dates out in the open, get married etc. Homosexuality (in the US) is way more accepted and ‘mainstream’ now… Read more »
Sounds like some internalized homophobia here. I don’t see anything wrong with naked men or gay sex. In fact, I kind of like it. I don’t know if we want to refer to the gay bathhouse as a staple in the community, but it is part of the community. Nothing wrong with it. Stop shaming other gay men. We get enough of that already. It would be nice to accept and celebrate one another. We don’t all have to enjoy the same stuff, but we don’t need to condemn one another either.
Irresponsible and risky.
The HIV rate is down in part because bathhouses were closed.
Leave them closed.
I’ve never been to one and never wanted to. The closest I’ve come to anything like them is the sauna at the gym. And that was just mutual masturbation.
And here I thought the bars or clubs were a staple of our culture, I guess it once was for me because I went once with one of my best buds who was about 10yrs, my senior, as he always went right after the bars closed. I wasn’t into it at all, though, didn’t feel right for me. I think gay men get infected anywhere other gay men are present-cruise, like parks and the woods, etc.
I’m all for less government regulation and interference in anyone’s lives, but I’m sure everyone trumpeting this isn’t giving the same benefit to people they don’t agree with.. Also its 2020, who the hell needs a bath house?
Good grief! More things happen in bath houses. For instance, two couples (a total of four men) got married at the same time, in the same bath house but the two couples were NOT on the same wavelength. There was a substantial dowry given in each case.
I heard a similar story but with a twist. Sometime into their marriage, there was an adulterous sexual affair of some duration between one man in couple A and one man in couple B!
The baths at 8th and Howard streets had 200 private rooms and huge laybraneth steam room. There was always activity to be found
I turned 21 in 1971, Went to my first bathhouse in Detroit Mi in 1972. Loved it! Went back many times. Friday night a friend and I would drive from Saginaw to Detroit, or Toledo, Cleveland, then back to Saginaw in the morning. Saturday evening we would repeat. Even going on Sunday evenings. 99% of the time it was wonderful. LOTS of sex, but also talking and meeting new people. It was the greatest of times. I am not insulted by someone pointing out that it was a mainstay in gay life; because it was. People from all over the… Read more »
While the baths aren’t the pinnacle of morality or completely without risk, I believe the benefits offset the risks. If someone has an STI and chooses to ignore it, or if he is reluctant to learn his status, thereby potentially infecting others, he’s not playing safe anywhere. In my town, there are a ton of guys who either keep their poz status quiet or don’t get tested. Guys who might be driving around drunk or high, taking chances in risky places or with sketchy street hustlers, taking robbers home or to the hotel, getting carjacked, etc., should have an option… Read more »
I agree with readers especially regarding the safety issues. When the bathhouses closed in Minneapolis, guys ended up cruising in an area along the Mississippi River known as Bare Ass Beach. In 1991 two men where shot and killed at the beach as their killer had been diagnosed as HIV position and he planned to kill every guy he could that night. I lived above the beach and had planned on going there that night, I would have possibly been a victim. Bathhouses for the most part are safe, I’ve been in a few were they check your backpack (but… Read more »
I’ve never been to Steamworks and would like to ask you about it. Can you shoot me a message here and I’ll take it from there?
Well, San Diego still have one bathhouse I know of. It’s in the Hillcrest neighborhood.. called Club San Diego ad it’s currently open.
yes bring ’em back to SF, honey! we’re no longer in an age where HIV is such an issue as it was in the 1980’s and 90’s